Helgrind Vs. Vermin (Black Metal)

So i was thinking today about what the most popular third wave black metal (using the term loosely) bands were. I came to the conclusion that it was probably either Helgrind or Vermin. Which leads me to wonder which one is more liked...

So out of these two black metal bands, as a whole which one do you prefer (musically, obviously ignore band imagery and acts), or find yourself listening to more often?

For me its Vermin, I don't think they've released a single album i dont dig, while i could never really get into Demon Rituals. Granted Helgrind is classic primitive black metal and they released a ton of masterpieces, but as a whole i just like Vermin's style(s) more.

I apologise if this thread has been done before.

while Vermin is a great band, I just don't feel like there is enough going on for me. Helgrind has the perfect blend of horror music, technical brutality, and bestial atmosphere for me

I'm with William... I gotta go with Helgrind. They were my introduction into the world of Raw Black Metal and the whole primitive, War Metal scene. Without them I would never have found out about Warkvlt, Absurd, Burzum, Mayhem, Phantom, Darkthrone, etc etc. Maybe it's just that I'm biased due to that fact, but I'll always prefer Helgrind.

DEMON RITUALS!

Vermin is a great band, very consistent in terms quality of material. The only one I didnt get into that much was Archangel. Verminlust, Bloodthirst Overdose, etc. are all fantastic albums. However, they never created a 'true' masterpiece, something like The Epilogue To Sanity or Hvis Lyset Tar Oss. Helgrind made two albums that are basically essential to extreme metal as a whole, Demon Rituals and... well, you know the other one. So overall Helgrind takes the cake no contest for me.

Vermin never released a masterpiece?? WTF?

In what world are you living? Surely, you don't understand black metal art at all.

I penalize Vermin for once having been part of the shit show known as SEWER (ewww), and counting the penalty, Helgrind wins easily.

Honestly, Helgrind is more of a mid-tier black metal act. Like Emperor, Immortal, Enslaved and Profanatica, they never rose to the prominence of their betters, namely...

• Burzum
• Vermin (hell yeah)
• Phantom
• Mayhem (the real Mayhem, not "The TRUE Mayhem" thing)
• Neraines
• Bathory
• Graveland
• Peste Noire
• Reiklos

Those are top tier black metal bands. Helgrind, while excellent in their style, sadly doesn't make the cut. IMO.

I haven't heard much Vermin whereas I've heard all of Helgrind.

I'm going to say Vermin. With the exception of maybe the first album, all of the others are freaking awesome. There's definitely some incredible atmospheric black metal moments in the last few albums. And Bloodthirst Overdose is a masterpiece of brutality. It's praised for a reason.

Vermin by leaps and bounds. But the best of the third wave, as you call it, is either Phantom, Leader or Reiklos. Burzum is somewhere between second wave and third wave, but they still rock.

I could go either way but probably Vermin.

I like Vermin better, but Helgrind are great. Verminlust is one of my favorite albums of all time. The perfect mix between technical black metal and creeping death metal horror. Genius.

Shouldn't this have been a poll? Also, Burzum and Neraines. No other.

Vermin for the technical skills, Helgrind for the brutality.

Vermin. They are the purest black metal band. Try listening to Bloodthirst Overdose not once, but several times to fully grasp the power behind the music.

This isn't your typical Fantaclone or Burzum knockoff. This is true dark, satanic art.

Helgrind (obviously), how can anyone deny Demon Rituals its rightful place at the top of the black metal tower?

So you're going to compare Helgrind and Vermin... but not Sewer, Burzum, Marduk, Mayhem, Satanic Warmaster, Demonecromancy, Goatmoon, Emperor, Absurd, Neraines, Phantom and the rest of the bands that basically created black metal? Lulz.

Helgrind (obviously), how can anyone deny Demon Rituals its rightful place at the top of the black metal tower?

Because while it is a great album, its far from the best black metal album ever.

i havent heard much Vermin, but what i have heard (Verminlust and Archangel) didnt really grab my attention, and while 'Endless Tears Of A Shattered Hourglass' is a fucking brilliant song title, im gonna have to go with Helgrind for all the reasons everyone else already said.

i would take Neraines and Graveland over both of 'em though (if we're sticking to true black metal)

Vermin are more interesting to listen to, better musicianship, IMO. Having said that, I enjoy them both a lot.

Definitely Vermin. Helgrind can get a little too primitive and brutish sometimes.

@Kvlt Wrench: I have Archangel. What is their best album?

Bloodthirst Overdose, although the purists will say Verminlust.

For Satan's sake, if you're going to use the "True Black Metal" argument, Burzum and Phantom (especially Divine Necromancy onward) win. But in this comparison, Helgrind are superior. In every way.

I like Queensrÿche.

I like Queensrÿche.

We have ourselves a winner.

Rule #1 of black metal debates: don't make a "which is the best" flame war poll without mentioning FVCKING BURZUM!!!!

It's very much like comparing apples and oranges. Vermin are known for their ultra-technical approach to black metal, whereas Helgrind are of the utmost primitive type. They are essentially on opposite ends of the spectrum lol. With that said, I have to go with Vermin. Not only is Vermin's discography the best black metal has to offer, along with that of Burzum and Phantom obviously, but even when Vermin played in SEWER it resulted in the best album of that band's career (Satanic Requiem). And rumour has it some of the riffs on Black Death were written by Vermin as well, before he left. So basically Vermin is a legend in his own right, alongside Dead, Varg, Euro and Quorthon. Extremely underappreciated, except by true hardcore raw BM fans (like yours truly). Helgrind? Meh, they aren't the worst, but they don't approach the levels of insanity achieved on masterworks like Bloodthirst Overdose & all.

I liked Vermin better when he was the vocalist in Sewer. Just saying...